The delivery industry boomed during the COVID-19 pandemic. In New York City, the engine of this expansion was app-based delivery workers, many of whom are immigrants. On this episode of Policy Outsider, Institute on Immigrant Integration Research and Policy Deputy Director & Intergovernmental Liaison Guillermo Martinez interviews Rockefeller Institute Director of Labor Policy Maria Figueroa about her research into the efforts of these workers to secure improved working conditions and compensation.
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Joel Tirado 00:03
Welcome to Policy Outsider presented by the Rockefeller Institute of Government. I’m Joel Tirado. The delivery industry boomed during the COVID-19 pandemic. In New York City, the engine of this expansion were app-based delivery workers, many of whom are immigrants. On today’s episode of Policy Outsider, Institute on Immigrant Integration Research and Policy Deputy Director & Intergovernmental Liaison Guillermo Martinez interviews Rockefeller Institute Director of Labor Policy Maria Figueroa about her research into the efforts of these workers to secure improved working conditions and compensation. That conversation is up next.
Guillermo Martinez 00:59
I’m honored to welcome today’s guest Doctor Maria Figueroa, the director of labor policy at the Rockefeller Institute of Government of the State University of New York,
Guillermo Martinez 01:08
with deep expertise spanning Labor and Employment Policy, gig economy research, immigration, labor organizations and workforce development, Doctor Figueroa brings a rich and informed perspective. Her work has contributed to both academic literature and practical policy solutions, examining how digital platforms and sectors such in construction, health care and the arts impact workforce in the modern economy. Early in her career, the Figueroa worked as a researcher for major organizations, including the teamsters in the United Nations center on transitional corporations. Welcome Doctor Figueroa. Today we’re diving into a compelling case study titled an industry of immigrants, a city of immigrants. The case of food delivery workers in New York City is a story about the power of community advocacy and inclusive governance and improving labor conditions for app based food delivery workers in New York City, a workforce largely made up of immigrants. Doctor figador, earlier this year, during your annual conference on immigrant integration, hosted by the Institute on immigrant integration research and policy, you presented on your findings in a case study of how labor conditions were dramatically improved for app days food delivery workers in New York City. Can you give us a brief overview and why you took on this study and what you’re finding tell us before we get into a deeper discussion on your research? Sure. And thank you, Guillermo for inviting me for this interview.
Maria Figueroa 02:40
Yes, I’ve been studying labor issues in the digital platform economy for about 10 years now, since the platforms began to penetrate and disrupt industries like transportation, food service, etc, my focus on the food delivery industry and the apps and the workers in that sector began really during the first few months of the pandemic,
Maria Figueroa 03:13
back in 2020
Maria Figueroa 03:15
some four months into the pandemic, a worker organization, community based organization called worker Justice Project was already representing workers in construction and some restaurant industries or establishments which all closed down as a result of the pandemic, and so workers were looking for her new sources of revenue, and that’s how they join the food delivery the app based food delivery industry. So these members, these workers who were members of the worker justice project were going to the center, which was open, and informed that there were a lot of workers out there needing services and representation. And that’s when worker Justice Project approached me, and I was at Cornell, then labor Research Director, and we started a survey to assess the needs and the conditions of the workers in the out base for delivery. Of course, we encounter a lot of issues and related to algorithmic management, she’s what these companies like DoorDash, Uber Eats and Grubhub use to manage the workforce and connect them with restaurants and consumers. So. As a result of of that research that we conducted, together with wjP, we were able to quantify the problem which is important for policy makers. And so wjP, you know, was with that tool, was able to start a policy development effort that is still ongoing in many ways. And so at that time, we reach out to 500 workers, and we were able to ascertain that 65,000 workers were laboring in that sector. More recently, the Department of Consumer and worker protection, DC, WP, for short, which is an the agency of New York City government that administers these protections that were achieved for for delivery workers, they found that there are 61,000 workers now. So the this workforce is predominantly male and immigrant. 75% identify as males. And although there is no data published on nativity, this cwp, DC, WP reports that 39% of delivery workers have limited English proficiency. And in an in that earlier study that we conducted back in 2020 2021, we found that about 30% of the workers were immigrants from Mexico and Guatemala, 21% were from Asian countries, and about 10% from African countries. So in our 2021 study, we also found that the most pressing issues for workers were low pay and other issues related to the hazardous conditions they encounter when performing their work. 56% of the workers use E bikes, electric bikes, or motorcycles as their mode of transportation. So, you know, that indicates that they don’t, the majority doesn’t drive cars, right? Which makes it a bit significantly more hazardous, you know, to perform the work, since they have to deal with traffic and weather conditions and also crime, because they are often victims of robberies. Because of criminals can steal their bikes, and in the process of robbing the bikes, they they also assault the delivery workers. So it’s a very vulnerable workforce. Other issues included lack of transparency on the on the part of the apps in terms of the distances that they had to travel to perform the work and and also they didn’t have access to bathrooms. So these were all issues that were particularly critical during the pandemic after, you know, a long process, but, you know, relatively short compared to other labor advocacy efforts. The New York City Council passed legislation in 2021 and address most of these issues. Many challenges emerge, though, and especially around the law that regulates the minimum pay rate. But yes, this was the beginning.
Guillermo Martinez 09:06
That was the beginning. Thank you for the for that overview. Yeah, it’s interesting to note that before the organization efforts started and the city made some changes to the workforce in terms of pay, the pay that was going to be made available. Food delivery workers are making five, $7 an hour in one of the most expensive cities in the world. So you know, to put that into context, and it also leads to my next question, which is, you gave me some statistics about the limited English proficiency of these workers, and of course, the low pay that they were getting, what strategies that the organizations like workers Justice Project and Los deliveristas unidos used to mobile mobilize this immigrant workforce to build this effective campaign,
Maria Figueroa 09:56
yes and yeah and. And before I address your question, I just like to say that, yeah, you just mentioned those deliveristas Unidos, and that is actually sort of like a subgroup that the worker justice project for as a result of its efforts in organizing and representing the delivery workers. So yes, and the specific strategies, I would say, include, first of all, the outreach to workers to learn about the issues that they were confronting and to assess their interest in joining an advocacy effort. WjP and Los deliberitas unidos could do this outreach because they are a grassroots organization, and their members were already part of the workforce in that sense, they were already embedded in this workforce and in their communities. Another factor very important that helped the organizing effort was that workers were already organized, or self organized in groups which were based in family and social networks. They transplanted from their hometowns in their countries of origin. In addition to this outreach that wjP worker justice project conducted, they organized two massive marches to City Hall, one in October 2020, with 1000 workers, and the other in April of 2021, with more than 3000 workers. You know. And in these marches, you know, the workers were waving the flags from their home countries. And in the last March, they even brought a mariachi band. So it was a very colorful demonstration that really called the attention of policymakers and the general public, and overall, the Los deliveritas leaders were affected in bringing public attention to the issues, The massive marches, multiple rallies, and bringing delivery workers to provide testimony in public hearings, and reaching out to the press consistently, an important piece of the air for, especially for policy development, was the production of the research report that I mentioned earlier. And because, as you know, policy makers need to see numbers or the extent of and magnitude of the problem that they are expected to address. So the Cornell report helped to focus the attention of city council members who introduced bills in early 2021
Guillermo Martinez 13:18
so in your presentation, the you mentioned New York City sanctuary policies as part of the policy context that made the organization of and advocacy in the fight for deliverista’s rights with without having a fear for repercussions. Could you elaborate a little bit more on
Maria Figueroa 13:39
that? Sure the sanctuary laws play a key role, because they restrict the cooperation of local authorities with federal immigration enforcement agencies so workers feel safe to organize collectively and to seek help from advocates and policy makers, because the sanctuary laws of the city ensure that the information about their immigration status and other personal information would not be shared with federal immigration authorities by any city agency. So in the case of the minimum pay law, for example, for delivery workers, the DC WP the Department of Consumer worker protections, clearly states on their website that all cover workers have the same rights and protections under the laws, regardless of immigration status. And the agency also states that they will not ask about workers immigration status. And and that it will not share worker information with any governmental entities that enforce in migration law
Guillermo Martinez 15:09
that’s really important for a group that, again, like I mentioned, was making less than $7 an hour and would be scared at standing up for their rights. They could face deeper repercussions and actually face deportation. So for the food delivery based workers, the minimum wage went up to $21.44 starting April of this year. What were the key challenges faced during the policy development and the implement implementation process to become resistance for the pay raise as it was opposed by major delivery apps?
Maria Figueroa 15:46
Sure, yeah. The main challenges were related to, as you said, the resistance on the part of the apps to implement and abide by the new minimum pay law. This resistance took the form of lawsuits against the city of New York as soon as the Department of Consumer and worker protection determined the level of minimum pay at 17 point $96 per hour in June of 2023 the major delivery apps suit the city seeking to stop the minimum pay rate from taking effect. Nonetheless, in December of 2023 the minimum pay goes into effect after a New York Court of Appeals ruling in favor of its implementation. So the rate of 17 point 96 per hour went into effect immediately on December 4, 2023 increasing to 19 point 56 in April 2024, and to 20 point 21 point 44 in April of this year, this will rate will continue to increase at the pace of inflation in following years. So this was indeed a historic achievement of the city government and the workers. The minimum pay rate law was the first of its kind in the nation. Seattle followed less than a year later with their own law too, for a minimum pay rate for food delivery workers who were using paps to provide this service. So since, since the DC WP the Department of student worker protection begin enforcing the minimum pay rate in in December, apps have paid an additional, an additional $700 million in wages to the more than 60,000 New York City, restaurant delivery workers, and this is money that gets spent in local businesses. So, yeah, the challenges were mostly legal. Of course, these apps, they have very deep pockets, and they run very effective public ads and campaigns, TV ads, campaigns, etc, which can influence, you know, legal outcomes. But in, in, in all throughout this process of legal challenges, los deliveristas unidos continue their their public campaign in favor of the workers,
Guillermo Martinez 18:41
those major obstacles to overcome during your presentation, you also mentioned there consistently some challenges due to loopholes in the minimum pay regulations. What specific policy changes or interventions do you believe are most urgently needed to address these ongoing challenges for delivery workers?
Maria Figueroa 19:00
Sure, yeah. And the persistent issues and loopholes involved mainly lack of transparency in the payments, as the apps were not required to provide workers with itemized breakdowns of time worked and pay received, many of these loopholes have been closed recently in July, 14 of this year through a new package of legislation introduced and passed by the city council. So about the issues and the loopholes that you know were resolved. The apps were, for instance, not required to disclose the payment method they were going to use at the beginning of the work week. And the law local law 115 which regulates the minimum pay rate. Paid actually involves a rather complicated payment system and and so it really helps if the workers know how their pay is going to be calculated, so they know what to expect at the end of the work week and and so this new legislation requires that the apps disclose that disclose whether they are going to use the standard method or the so called alternative method. The standard method is in the aggregate. It pays for on call time this the alternative method pays a higher rate, but only per trip time. But we don’t need to go into the weeds of the system, the payment system, because, as I said, it’s rather complicated. Following the 2023 minimum pay law implementation, the app companies begin to use very opaque pay structures that obscure and reduce the actual earnings of workers. So this new legislation passed in July 14 included a bill that prevents or combat these practices by requiring companies to share their pay calculation before each weekly pay also, as soon as the minimum pay law went into effect, the apps began discouraging consumers from tipping the delivery workers by making it optional, and at the end of the ordering process, other apps, instead of suggesting percentages like 10% 15% 20% of the value of the order, they started providing figures like $3 $5 $8 dollars, all with the purpose of making the order look cheaper to the consumer. The legislation recently passed by the city council included two bills requiring apps to restore tipping options to the beginning of the ordering process and to clearly display minimum tipping standards, other loopholes in the original law exempted smaller platforms like relay and monoclick, as well as grocery delivery apps like Instacart. The new builds close these loopholes requiring all apps across the app based delivery industry to comply with all pay and protection standards required by the local laws. However, the new legislation still needs to be signed by the mayor, and the apps are already running an aggressive TV ad campaign to stop the mayor’s final approval. One last challenge that persists but hopefully will be addressed, is the unjustified the activation of workers by the apps. And so a couple of weeks ago, Council Member Justin Brown and introduced a bill that would prohibit the wrongful, the wrongful the activation of delivery workers by the UPS delivery companies. But there hasn’t been a vote on this bill yet,
Guillermo Martinez 23:30
and for our listeners, the activation is the deliverista wakes up and is his ability to be part of that network. It has been disengaged, right? And and then they have to battle that, the that scenario. But of course, while the legislation you mentioned is is in a work, so it’s been introduced, the idea of enforcing it seems really tough, because now we’re dealing with micro level issues of positive, you know, affecting 61,000 possible drivers, right, delivery workers, correct? So it’s complicated. You underscore the that the collaboration between local governments and community based organizations that help make all this possible. How would you suggest that this model could be scaled up, this collaboration model be scaled up in other industries and other regions to help workers.
Maria Figueroa 24:24
Yes, in many ways, the deliveristas case is an example of participatory policy making. Worker Justice Project and Los deliveristas unidos collaborated with city council members in the development of the bills, the city council organized public hearings, which gave an opportunity to all stakeholders to express their concerns and describe their issues. The Department of Consumer worker protection, which which was charged with implementing and enforcing the. Protections. Made sure to consult with all stakeholders, including the deliveristas and the apps. The consultation took place as public hearings and also, as you know, individual meetings, also DC WP participates in the outreach efforts of wjP los de liberitas unidos to disseminate educational materials to workers about the laws and the new protections. Lastly, in terms of enforcement, DC, WP collaborates with los de liberitas unidos in processing worker claims when they experience violations of their rights. DC, WP is in direct communication with Los deliveristas unidos staff for all these cases. This is what scholars are calling co enforcement. That’s the fancy name for this that scholars have coined, but it’s a practice that is being implemented in in other cities such as San Francisco and Seattle. Some key takeaways for me from this experience that could be developed or could be guidelines for for other localities is that it’s important to support community based organizations that represent immigrant workers. This support is an investment in our local communities, as these organizations promote workforce development and integration of immigrants, who in turn contribute to our local economy.
Guillermo Martinez 26:52
Right? You touch on something very important, which is inclusive governance, which here at the Institute, we’re engaged in doing some deeper studies and and doing a survey, a statewide survey, to gage inclusive governance and and measure inclusion governance, and so in this case, it’s really important, because inclusive governance limits or prevents the political alienation of immigrants and workers. How do you see the representation of immigrant workers within the community based organizations that carried out the big push for the policy outcomes. How do you see this as another model that could be built on?
Maria Figueroa 27:32
Yes, yes, representation of immigrant workers, worker Justice Project and love deliveristas, unidos played a critical role in the policy development process. And as I mentioned earlier, WGP members are all immigrants, and many of them became deliveristas in 2020 so WP, wjP, leaders and members drove this advocacy effort because they represented these workers who were all immigrants the LD, you love deliveristas. Leaders were very effective in defining the policy problem as an essential worker issue, right? We saw shine away from the immigrant characteristic of this workforce. They frame it as the typical immigrant story in a city built by immigrants and in many cases run by immigrants, and they were able to prevail despite the multi million dollar campaign that the apps run in New York and across the country to stop this type of legislation from being passed. So a key factor that played, also a critic, a critical role in all these is that the New York City government includes not only progressive and pro labor policy makers, but also first generation Americans and foreign born individuals and people of color, so in many respects and independently of their immigration status, the delivery workers are represented in city government, also in in terms of lessons for other cities. I think this case highlights the key role, again, that community based organizations can play in promoting not only the immigrants integration, but also their economic and social advancement. It is very important to note that the success of these efforts depends on the support that this CO. Community based organizations are able to obtain from public or private funders, as I noted earlier.
Guillermo Martinez 30:07
Well, thank you. Thank you, Dr Figueroa, for that information.
Guillermo Martinez 30:13
Today’s discussion not only showcases innovative strategies for immigrant integration and economic advancement, but also over valuable lessons for fostering civic engagement and collaboration between local governments and communities, and as we all just heard, having people that look like the people who would like to be represented on important seats at the table, it’s critically important to help in the shape policy. Is there anything else you’d like to add that figured on?
Maria Figueroa 30:43
Um, I again, the importance of community organizations that are doing work to support immigrant workers is critical, and, and, and also critical is the representation of immigrants and immigrant workers in city government. And I think New York is a is a great case example of how well these factors can drive protections for workers, which are really investments in the workforce, with, again, you know, result into investments in our local economies, Because as these workers advance economically. You know, they reinvest in our communities. So I think it’s a win win.
Joel Tirado 31:49
Thanks again to Institute on Immigrant Integration Research and Policy Deputy Director & Intergovernmental Liaison Guillermo Martinez and Rockefeller Institute Director of Labor Policy Maria Figueroa for this important conversation. If you liked this episode, please rate, subscribe, and share. It will help others find the podcast and help us deliver the latest in public policy research. All of our episodes are available for free wherever you stream your podcasts and transcripts are available on our website. I’m Joel Tirado; until next time.
Joel Tirado 32:27
Policy Outsider is presented by the Rockefeller Institute of Government, the public policy research arm of the State University of New York. The Institute conducts cutting-edge nonpartisan public policy research and analysis to inform lasting solutions to the challenges facing New York state and the nation. Learn more at rockinst.org or by following RockefellerInst. That’s i n s t on social media. Have a question comment or idea? Email us at [email protected].
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